Gun store Shooting Locations It is currently Thu Mar 28, 2024 12:43 pm



Rules WGO Chat Room Gear Rent Me Shield NRA SAF CCKRBA
Calendar


Forum rules


Nothing contained in this section shall be construed as legal advice. All members and guests are advised to perform due diligence in regards to laws and legal actions.



Reply to topic  [ 36 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3  Next
 ATF possibly looking to redefine large frame pistols as AOWs 
Author Message
Site Supporter
User avatar
Site Supporter

Location: Pierce County
Joined: Wed Nov 14, 2018
Posts: 1980
Real Name: Shane
This is a rumor, there's not much concrete about it available, but several sites have reported that the ATF is possibly considering redefining large frame pistols as AOWs and regulating them under the NFA.

Source: https://comms.wiley.law/8/3583/october-2020/alert--atf-interpretive-change-restricts-handgun-imports-and-may-require-nfa-registration(2).asp

I don't think it needs to be said how significant of a policy change this would be, nor how much of an upheaval it will be for many existing gun owners... but I'll say it anyway. This would not be good. Hopefully this is just a rumor, but given the ATF's recent animus towards Q (the honey badger fiasco) and the rumors a few months ago that they were looking into braces, this has all the hallmarks of a disaster.

_________________
Posts not legal advice.


Mon Oct 26, 2020 3:40 pm
Profile
Site Supporter
User avatar
Site Supporter

Location: Spanaway WA
Joined: Wed Jul 6, 2011
Posts: 6301
Real Name: Hugo Stiglitz
So a S&W 500 is now an AOW?

Seems legit.


Mon Oct 26, 2020 3:48 pm
Profile
Site Supporter
User avatar
Site Supporter

Location: Shelton, WA
Joined: Sat Dec 17, 2011
Posts: 1128
Real Name: Norm
What would they stop at when classifying a "large frame"? Most holster makers consider a P226 or a 1911 as a large frame auto...
And whats to stop them from immediately moving to regulate compacts as they are much easier to conceal and more likely to be used illicitly then?
This BS has got to be put in check! They are there to enforce, not legislate!


Mon Oct 26, 2020 3:58 pm
Profile
Site Supporter
User avatar
Site Supporter

Location: Pierce County
Joined: Wed Nov 14, 2018
Posts: 1980
Real Name: Shane
Normanator wrote:
What would they stop at when classifying a "large frame"? Most holster makers consider a P226 or a 1911 as a large frame auto...
And whats to stop them from immediately moving to regulate compacts as they are much easier to conceal and more likely to be used illicitly then?
This BS has got to be put in check! They are there to enforce, not legislate!
The article provides a list of factors they seem to be considering:

In some of the new letters, ATF has begun listing the following “objective design features” when making its evaluations:

Incorporation of rifle sights;
Utilization of "rifle caliber ammunition" (both 5.56mm and 7.62mm have been considered as such);
Incorporation of “rifle-length barrel;”
The “weapon’s heavy weight;”
Ability to accept magazines that range in capacity from 20 rounds to 100 rounds, “which will contribute to the overall weight of the firearm”; and
Overall length of the weapon which “creates a front-heavy imbalance when held in one hand.

_________________
Posts not legal advice.


Mon Oct 26, 2020 4:01 pm
Profile
Site Supporter
User avatar
Site Supporter

Location: Can't say
Joined: Sun Sep 7, 2014
Posts: 8134
Rather than doublding down on the complex artibrary fabricated definitions, it would be nice if they'd just go the opposite direction and disband all of the silliness.

I'd honestly propose no more legally consequential definitions and terms used only loosely to identify what the receiver is regardless as to whether it is a pistol that shoots rifle ammo or a rifle that shoots pistol ammo, etc. It's a firearm, with loose definitions as we generally use them.

_________________
I defend the 2A. US Army Combat Veteran and Paratrooper: OIF Veteran. BSM and MSM recipient. NRA Lifetime. Entertainment purposes only. I'm a lawyer, but have not offered you legal advice.


Mon Oct 26, 2020 4:16 pm
Profile
Site Supporter
User avatar
Site Supporter

Location: Marysville
Joined: Wed Feb 29, 2012
Posts: 1319
Real Name: Drew
I am actually surprised that "braces" are still legal.


Mon Oct 26, 2020 4:17 pm
Profile
Site Admin
User avatar
Site Admin

Location: Renton, WA
Joined: Sun Mar 13, 2011
Posts: 51917
Real Name: Steve
leadcounsel wrote:
Rather than doublding down on the complex artibrary fabricated definitions, it would be nice if they'd just go the opposite direction and disband all of the silliness.

I'd honestly propose no more legally consequential definitions and terms used only loosely to identify what the receiver is regardless as to whether it is a pistol that shoots rifle ammo or a rifle that shoots pistol ammo, etc. It's a firearm, with loose definitions as we generally use them.


BOOM

The bottom line is that all of the "silliness" is completely irrelevant in terms of safety, and we waste an incredible amount of time and money playing these games.

Just call it a gun, and move on.

_________________
Steve

Benefactor Life Member, National Rifle Association
Life Member, Second Amendment Foundation
Patriot & Life Member, Gun Owners of America
Life Member, Citizens Committee for the Right to Keep and Bear Arms
Legal Action Supporter, Firearms Policy Coalition
Member, NAGR/NFGR

Please support the organizations that support all of us.

Leave it cleaner than you found it.


Mon Oct 26, 2020 4:51 pm
Profile
Site Supporter
User avatar
Site Supporter

Location: Central FL
Joined: Sun Apr 7, 2013
Posts: 3207
The whole “held by a single hand” thing is ridiculous. Everyone is taught and practices a 2 hand grip with any pistol. Strap the SBA3 to my forearm and I can shoot my 10” AR pistol one handed pretty much as easily as a shooting a Glock one handed.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Mon Oct 26, 2020 4:57 pm
Profile
Site Admin
User avatar
Site Admin

Location: Renton, WA
Joined: Sun Mar 13, 2011
Posts: 51917
Real Name: Steve
edogg wrote:
The whole “held by a single hand” thing is ridiculous. Everyone is taught and practices a 2 hand grip with any pistol.


Maybe "held by a single hand in the movies" would be more accurate.

_________________
Steve

Benefactor Life Member, National Rifle Association
Life Member, Second Amendment Foundation
Patriot & Life Member, Gun Owners of America
Life Member, Citizens Committee for the Right to Keep and Bear Arms
Legal Action Supporter, Firearms Policy Coalition
Member, NAGR/NFGR

Please support the organizations that support all of us.

Leave it cleaner than you found it.


Mon Oct 26, 2020 5:03 pm
Profile
Site Supporter
User avatar
Site Supporter

Location: In my Cave near the Cloquallum
Joined: Thu Sep 26, 2013
Posts: 7758
Real Name: Jim Sr.
When Trump is reelected he needs to go in and gut these federal agencies of these liberal progressive communist bastard’s!!!
Do you wanna know how I really feel??? :alcapone: :alcapone: :alcapone:

_________________
"You are either with us...as Americans. Or, You are against us. There is no IN BETWEEN." ???

"We cannot negotiate with those who say, 'What's mine is mine, and what's yours is negotiable.'" JFK

"Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety”

-Ben Franklin

MadPick wrote:
I don't think you beat your children enough. :ROFLMAO:


Mon Oct 26, 2020 5:24 pm
Profile
User avatar

Location: Puyallup
Joined: Tue Sep 18, 2018
Posts: 3026
"Upheaval for existing gun owners"? Not for this one, 'cause I don't give a flying fuck about their arbitrary bullshit. Ain't changin' nothin'.

They do need to be reigned in though, once and for all. Maybe during Preesident Trumps second term, some strides will be made.

Rumor or not, FUCK the BATFE. #willnotcomplywithshit

_________________
I'm a Morlock, in a land of Eloi...


Mon Oct 26, 2020 5:37 pm
Profile
Site Supporter
User avatar
Site Supporter

Location: Everson, WA
Joined: Sun Jan 6, 2013
Posts: 28149
Real Name: Ace Winky
Is Trump even aware of this shit? As far as I can tell they (ATF) seem to be chugging on with the liberal wet dream and Trump is wholly unaware.

Is NRA.GOA.SAF getting this to him????

EDIT: Does it even matter that very few crimes are committed with such firearms?

_________________
Why does the Penguin in Batman sound like a duck?

Because the eagle sounds like a hawk.


Last edited by Pablo on Mon Oct 26, 2020 6:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Mon Oct 26, 2020 6:34 pm
Profile
Site Admin
User avatar
Site Admin

Location: Renton, WA
Joined: Sun Mar 13, 2011
Posts: 51917
Real Name: Steve
Pablo wrote:
Is Trump even aware of this shit? As far as I can tell they (ATF) seem to be chugging on with the liberal wet dream and Trump is wholly unaware.

Is NRA.GOA.SAF getting this to him????

EDIT: Does it even matter than very few crimes are committed with such firearms?


Great questions.

_________________
Steve

Benefactor Life Member, National Rifle Association
Life Member, Second Amendment Foundation
Patriot & Life Member, Gun Owners of America
Life Member, Citizens Committee for the Right to Keep and Bear Arms
Legal Action Supporter, Firearms Policy Coalition
Member, NAGR/NFGR

Please support the organizations that support all of us.

Leave it cleaner than you found it.


Mon Oct 26, 2020 6:36 pm
Profile
Site Supporter
User avatar
Site Supporter

Location: Can't say
Joined: Sun Sep 7, 2014
Posts: 8134
MadPick wrote:
Pablo wrote:
Is Trump even aware of this shit? As far as I can tell they (ATF) seem to be chugging on with the liberal wet dream and Trump is wholly unaware.

Is NRA.GOA.SAF getting this to him????

EDIT: Does it even matter than very few crimes are committed with such firearms?


Great questions.


The head of the SAF is in pretty tight with Trump. I see him on FB going to many Trump events and meeting with him so I would assume he has a direct line...

_________________
I defend the 2A. US Army Combat Veteran and Paratrooper: OIF Veteran. BSM and MSM recipient. NRA Lifetime. Entertainment purposes only. I'm a lawyer, but have not offered you legal advice.


Mon Oct 26, 2020 6:58 pm
Profile
Site Supporter
User avatar
Site Supporter

Location: Everson, WA
Joined: Sun Jan 6, 2013
Posts: 28149
Real Name: Ace Winky
Please contact SAF. I will too.

_________________
Why does the Penguin in Batman sound like a duck?

Because the eagle sounds like a hawk.


Mon Oct 26, 2020 7:02 pm
Profile
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Reply to topic   [ 36 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3  Next

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 39 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum



Rules WGO Chat Room Gear Rent Me NRA SAF CCKRBA
Calendar


Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group
Designed by ST Software for PTF.
[ Time : 1.202s | 16 Queries | GZIP : Off ]