If possible do not get tangled up in the numbers game.

Yes, the higher the magnification number the bigger the picture will appear but the real question is "Will it be clear enough to see what you need to see.

Prime example: I have two NightForce scopes. Yes, very expensive scopes. One is a 12-42X56 and the other is a 5-25X56. You'd think the 12-42 would do better at long ranges but in fact, the 5-25 is far clearer and has served me well out to beyond 1100 yards.

The key is not large magnification but quality of "glass".

For shooting out to 300 yards 12-15 power is more than adequate if the quality of the glass is such that you get a nice clear picture. Lots of options from all the popular names, Leupold, Nikkon, Vortex, Meopta, Cabela's (private branded scopes often from high quality names), Millet, and on, and so forth.

One of the nicest low cost scopes I own is from Cabela's (made by Meopta in Czech Republic) that I bough on close-out for under $300. Has a Duplex Reticle rather than the sexier Mil-Dot but I only use the center + anyway. Glass is clear and magnification range is 8-32 with a 50mm Objective.

Don't expect much from bargain scopes (unless you find something you know is higher quality than it's sale price indicates). Best performance starts in the $800 and up range. My recommendation is to buy the best scope you can squeeze out of your wallet. If you don't eventually you will and then you'll have the beginning of an unused scope collection. Buy once and cry once.

BTW, that 5-25X56 NighForce I have that is fantastic is the BEAST. Price has four digits in it and the first number is a "4". In my opinion it's worth every cent.

5.56 a 4-12/16 should be enough.

Look at SWFA

I have a 6-18 that works well. It's no frills but does the job, and is all MRAD. It's a budget scope and a good value for the money

Thanks again guys. Lots of good info through this and I think I'm in a better spot to make a purchase.

I was in Tacoma this afternoon so I stopped in at Bass Pro but the gun counter was swamped so I lost interest quickly after peering at the display scopes. Overwhelming selection

SWFA makes excellent scopes for a reasonable price. I had a fixed 20x42 on my 50bmg. It held up to the enormous recoil of that rifle.

This....Great scopes for the money.

+1 for SWFA. Buddy has a fixed 10x and I have a fixed 16x. Glass is far superior to my old Barska, and definitely clearer than my Primary Arms 4-14x44 FFP mildot and ACSS models.

Ive got a fixed 12x from SWFA that doesnt get used a lot but their 1-6x used to live on my SCAR17 till i got a Trijicon 1-8.

Well...if I may put in a few cents worth...

There is lots of useful information in this thread; there are a couple of questions that I might be able to help with (as in, the OP).

First...mils v MOA. Both are standard units of measurement for shooters. The difference is simply the measurement that each takes in.

One MOA = one minute of angle, which us VERY close to one inch at 100 yards. For us, it's easier to use right off the bat because we think in inches here anyway.

One mil = one milradian = 3.6 inches. That's the only difference. So...depending on what you're comfortable with, simply learn each system.

As to scopes, since you want to get into long range shooting, you'll want to select a scope that offers a good assortment of desirable features. You want quality, repeatability and durability. And right there is where the corn is cut. QUALITY and PRICE rarely meet at low levels, unless you get REALLY lucky.

So...what to look for? Some of these have been mentioned already above, but I'll list them again.

1. Range of adjustment. You want as much adjustment as possible within the scope body, because you will be shooting at various ranges. There are two reasons for big scope tubes---one is light gathering and the other is to put more adjustment into the scope as possible.

And don't be fooled by the number--if you see that a scope has 50 inches of adjustment, you might say, "Hey!!! That's great!"...until you realize that this figure means 50 inches/minutes from TOP to BOTTOM. Since your scope is at optical zero when you buy it (hopefully), this means that your true adjustment range is 25 minutes UP, and 25 minutes DOWN. However---if you find a new scope that has 50 MILS of adjustment, grab it quick--because that's over 75 inches UP or DOWN from optical zero. (By the way, the only scope I know that offers that much adjustment is made by March Riflescopes. Look it up...it's a monster!)

2. Clarity is extremely important. You'll be able to resolve your target better, and your adjustments will be more precise. A good scope will have clear glass all the way to the edges. I'd also hold out for etched reticles, so that you don't have to worry about crosshairs breaking.

3. As far as glass, know this: To the best of my knowledge, there are TWO providers of good scope glass nowadays.

If you buy: Leupold, Nightforce, Burris, Weaver, or Redfield, or Vortex--you're getting Japanese glass. And they make an outstanding product. I believe that even US Optics--long recognized as the very best American scope available--uses Japanese glass now.

If you buy: IOR Valdada, Kahles, Schmidt/Bender, Zeiss, Swarovski or other European scopes, your glass is made by Schott Glaswerk, in the former Deutsche Democratik Republik (DDR), formerly known as East Germany.

Bottom line: Buy once, cry once. Drop the coin, and get a GOOD scope right off the mark. There is one solution I would heartily recommend. Yes, it's still pricey, but you will DEFINITELY get what you pay for. This is the Nightforce SHV line. I recommend the 5-20, with the illuminated MOAR reticle. This scope--and its range of adjustment--will take you well beyond 1000 yards, especially if you put a 20 minute base on your rifle. And...yo90u can get the NON-illuminated reticle for just a hair under one thousand bucks.

I hope all of this helps...

Good advice from powderman




after all that, you start talking about first or second focal plane scopes. Do you want to be able to range using the mils in the reticle?

You'll have to get used to knowing or learning the dimensions of the targets you're looking at e.g. an elk will measure approx 24-26" from top of shoulder to bottom of chest... so measuring how many mil dots that is in your current view will allow you to calculate the range. Say that elk, from top of chest to bottom of shoulder is taking up 2 mils in your scope, you can estimate that it's approx 300-325 yds away...

With a FIRST focal plane scope, that range estimation can take place at any magnification. With a second focal plane scope, you will have to dial the scope back to some predetermined magnification (Usually 10 power?) in order to make your range estimates.

If you're at a shooting range with predetermined target distances, or you have a range finder, or you have taken time in advance to range your shooting area where you're hunting, then that become less important.

Sightron is reputed to have good glass and a decent price point.

https://www.opticsplanet.com/sightron-s ... scope.html

Myself, I'm a Leupold fan-boy. Vortex is nice in that they have a great warranty... but I've never liked how unforgiving their eye relief is. (but people using them win matches, so...)

And here I thought this would be a simple answer. Learning curve! I guess now I need to decide more on what my ultimate goal is for the rifle/scope. Several Vortex models look like they'll fill my needs for now.

Also have a look at some of the athlon scopes the street price is surprisingly good for options.

Here is a timely write-up that came today (oddly enough, since it has a dateline of Sept '18) from Guns America Digest about the Leupold Vx-3i LRP (long range precision) scopes.

-budget conscious
-throw lever
-side paralax adjustment
-ZERO STOPS* (these are pretty neato devices that enable you to return to your set zero if you've forgotten or lost track of your adjustments)
-zero stops are couple with a revolution indicator so you know how many full turns have been made
-80 MOA adjustment of internal adjustment (pretty sure that's total)
-probably about $1k or so.

https://www.gunsamerica.com/digest/leup ... rp-review/