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 Battle Belt, Duty Belt, EDC Belt? 
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So.... there's been lots of discussion about belts here. Leather belts, ratchet belts, cobra belts. Each has their distinct advantages and limitations.
For instance: a leather belt looks nice in a casual setting. A nice thick leather belt like a Hank's belt, will support large frame pistols and a few mag holsters... maybe even some other gear but if you don't want to go fully strapped with gear it means you're carrying and stowing that stuff off-body, and then doffing the belt, and then threading the holsters back on as you rethread the belt through your pants.

If you have a full padded battlebelt, well, that might cause a stir in the grocery store or a "sensitive place" :facepalm2: like a school or the P.O.. The advantage being, you have your leather belt on for casual wear and you can have a fully loaded battle belt stuffed under the front seat of the car for rapid deployment of a survival kit, one step below a full kit with armor.

A cobra belt buckle belt has a similar visual impact (like, "Wow, jukk0u must be a Tier One Operator; just look at that multi-cam rigger's belt and D ring for when he's swinging from helos" :thumbsup2: ) And if you wear a belt with a cobra buckle and don't have the pouches already loaded on the belt, adding them on is even more laborious than if you're just using a leather belt as you have to dismount one half of the cobra buckle as well. Belt mounted holsters wont slide over the cobra buckle.

So, how about "Operator" or shooter's belt kits that are being offered?

Many companies have cobra buckled belts with neoprene padding that can be clipped on over your street wear and rides independently of your Holding-up-your-pants belt. But, will they hold position if not run through your belt loops? :anyone:
https://www.highspeedgear.com/31ovi-31o ... hsgi=5496& You would select the option with the neoprene inner so it could be worn independently of your pants-holding-up-belt.

Then there's HSGI, GRBS, Beez, Esstac and other companies that have three and four part belt kits that allow you to run an inner belt through your belt loops, which velcro into place and use no buckle. This is the part that holds your britches on. I'm not sure I'm sold on that concept.

Since this inner belt has the hook part of the velcro which will interface with the load carrying outer belt (the load carrying belt that has holsters and pouches already attached), there is a sheath, or cover that you can wear over the inner belt to cover the velcro hook material when in a casual setting and don't need the load bearing outer belt and kit at that moment. When you need to attach the outer load carrying belt to go to the range... or deploy on some secret covert WaGuns mission, the sheath is pulled free (it isn't threaded through your belt loops; it's worn on top of the belt loops). You can stow it in your pocket, throw it in your pack or... I dunno, maybe use it for gagging the HVT you've just nabbed and are taking back for interrogation? Going to the grocery on the way home from the range, stow the load carrying portion under the truck seat and slap the inner belt cover back into place.

Here's some vids on the concept:

GBRS V3 or V2



HSGI ( the vid is two yearsold and not all of those belts are still available)



Here's a tier one guy talking about the concept in general:




Comments?

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Sun Feb 11, 2024 1:49 pm
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Are you planning on going commando Jimbo?

Just for shits and gigles I tried on a ballistic helmet this weekend at the gunshow, just to get a feel of it so if I decided I wanted to go commando. :bigsmile:

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Sun Feb 11, 2024 5:18 pm
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Caveman Jim wrote:
Are you planning on going commando Jimbo?

Just for shits and gigles I tried on a ballistic helmet this weekend at the gunshow, just to get a feel of it so if I decided I wanted to go commando. :bigsmile:


Jim has a Commando "helmet" too. :wink05:

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Sun Feb 11, 2024 6:36 pm
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Jim, is this you?

https://www.reddit.com/r/Unexpected/com ... &context=3

I'm not sure 'going commando' means what you think it means.

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"The said Constitution shall never be construed to authorize Congress to prevent the people of the United States who are peaceable citizens from keeping their own arms." ~ Samuel Adams

“A return to First Principles in a Republic is sometimes caused by simple virtues of a single man. His good example has such an influence that the good men strive to imitate him, and the wicked are ashamed to lead a life so contrary to his example. Before all else, be armed!” ~ Niccolo Machiavelli

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FJB


Sun Feb 11, 2024 10:24 pm
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Quote:
A cobra belt buckle belt has a similar visual impact (like, "Wow, jukk0u must be a Tier One Operator; just look at that multi-cam rigger's belt and D ring for when he's swinging from helos" :thumbsup2: ) And if you wear a belt with a cobra buckle and don't have the pouches already loaded on the belt, adding them on is even more laborious than if you're just using a leather belt as you have to dismount one half of the cobra buckle as well. Belt mounted holsters wont slide over the cobra buckle.


That part makes little sense. A holster isn't going to fit over any buckle and when you undo your leather (or nylon) belt, it's the same as if you'd "dismounted one half of the cobra buckle." If that's laborious, then you have much more serious issues than a belt (unless you're talking about finding one big enough to fit). A huge amount of people, especially in this area wear some sort of rigger's belt, with a cobra buckle, or one almost as large. In jeans or cargo pants, with their shirt over it. Might not work for a 70 year old who tucks all of their shirts in like it was 40 years ago I guess.

Are you comparing a 2 inch double, or padded, nylon belt with a Cobra Buckle to a 1.25 to 1.5 inch leather belt? Why not compare a 1.75inch belt with Cobra Buckle to a 2 or 2.25 inch leather duty belt? That makes the same sense are your statements here.


Mon Feb 12, 2024 6:39 pm
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Unicorn wrote:
Quote:
A cobra belt buckle belt has a similar visual impact (like, "Wow, jukk0u must be a Tier One Operator; just look at that multi-cam rigger's belt and D ring for when he's swinging from helos" :thumbsup2: ) And if you wear a belt with a cobra buckle and don't have the pouches already loaded on the belt, adding them on is even more laborious than if you're just using a leather belt as you have to dismount one half of the cobra buckle as well. Belt mounted holsters wont slide over the cobra buckle.


That part makes little sense. A holster isn't going to fit over any buckle and when you undo your leather (or nylon) belt, it's the same as if you'd "dismounted one half of the cobra buckle." If that's laborious, then you have much more serious issues than a belt (unless you're talking about finding one big enough to fit). A huge amount of people, especially in this area wear some sort of rigger's belt, with a cobra buckle, or one almost as large. In jeans or cargo pants, with their shirt over it. Might not work for a 70 year old who tucks all of their shirts in like it was 40 years ago I guess.

Are you comparing a 2 inch double, or padded, nylon belt with a Cobra Buckle to a 1.25 to 1.5 inch leather belt? Why not compare a 1.75inch belt with Cobra Buckle to a 2 or 2.25 inch leather duty belt? That makes the same sense are your statements here.


Well, that came off rather abrasively. Who pissed in your corn flakes?

Yes, I was comparing a cobra buckle to a buckle on a typical leather belt. You see, on a typical leather belt, there's no buckle on one end. On a cobra buckled belt, as you're aware, there are two halves; one half on each end of the belt which would necessitate removing one of the halves. Not insurmountable but another step.

Rather than trying to point out some flaw in my description in the least flattering way, perhaps you might share your own analysis and comparisons you suggest as my review doesn't measure up to your standards.

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“Finding ‘common ground’ with the thinking of evil men is a fool’s errand” ~ Herschel Smith

"The said Constitution shall never be construed to authorize Congress to prevent the people of the United States who are peaceable citizens from keeping their own arms." ~ Samuel Adams

“A return to First Principles in a Republic is sometimes caused by simple virtues of a single man. His good example has such an influence that the good men strive to imitate him, and the wicked are ashamed to lead a life so contrary to his example. Before all else, be armed!” ~ Niccolo Machiavelli

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FJB


Mon Feb 12, 2024 10:20 pm
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Look who’s suddenly sensitive…


Mon Feb 12, 2024 10:24 pm
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jukk0u wrote:
Unicorn wrote:
Quote:
A cobra belt buckle belt has a similar visual impact (like, "Wow, jukk0u must be a Tier One Operator; just look at that multi-cam rigger's belt and D ring for when he's swinging from helos" :thumbsup2: ) And if you wear a belt with a cobra buckle and don't have the pouches already loaded on the belt, adding them on is even more laborious than if you're just using a leather belt as you have to dismount one half of the cobra buckle as well. Belt mounted holsters wont slide over the cobra buckle.


That part makes little sense. A holster isn't going to fit over any buckle and when you undo your leather (or nylon) belt, it's the same as if you'd "dismounted one half of the cobra buckle." If that's laborious, then you have much more serious issues than a belt (unless you're talking about finding one big enough to fit). A huge amount of people, especially in this area wear some sort of rigger's belt, with a cobra buckle, or one almost as large. In jeans or cargo pants, with their shirt over it. Might not work for a 70 year old who tucks all of their shirts in like it was 40 years ago I guess.

Are you comparing a 2 inch double, or padded, nylon belt with a Cobra Buckle to a 1.25 to 1.5 inch leather belt? Why not compare a 1.75inch belt with Cobra Buckle to a 2 or 2.25 inch leather duty belt? That makes the same sense are your statements here.


Well, that came off rather abrasively. Who pissed in your corn flakes?

Yes, I was comparing a cobra buckle to a buckle on a typical leather belt. You see, on a typical leather belt, there's no buckle on one end. On a cobra buckled belt, as you're aware, there are two halves; one half on each end of the belt which would necessitate removing one of the halves. Not insurmountable but another step.

Rather than trying to point out some flaw in my description in the least flattering way, perhaps you might share your own analysis and comparisons you suggest as my review doesn't measure up to your standards.


You remove the belt from one half of the buckle in either case. There is no difference between the two. The difference comes when you unbuckle to drop your pants, because you don't have to undo the belt to remove it, just unclip the buckle.


Last edited by Unicorn on Tue Feb 13, 2024 10:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Tue Feb 13, 2024 3:40 pm
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Leather, thick, wide and stiff. Easy to buckle on or off and the buckle doesn't scream "I'm an operator." (well, it would only scream that to another "operator") I can't imagine trying to wear a "Battle belt" or some of that other high speed Operator shit for an EDC.

I mean, how much shit are you trying to put on that belt?? Pistol strong side, Spare Mag carrier on the other, what else do you really need for going about your everyday business?

Is it that hard to thread the belt through a holster, Mag pouch and some belt loops that a Leather gun belt is not a good choice?

If you need a Radio, Pepper spray, Handcuffs, IFAK and a collapsible baton on your belt too, you might as well strap on a Load carrying vest and armor with that "battle belt" for that run to the Grocery store.

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Tue Feb 13, 2024 7:29 pm
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Mission dictates gear.

If you're going to the grocery store, just about any sturdy belt will do. I prefer thick leather, but the ratcheting nylon belts are nice because you can make micro-adjustments on the fly. Either way, it just needs to be enough to hold your pants up, including all your EDC gear. For me, EDC gear is pistol (leather IWB), spare mag (leather IWB), folding knife, flashlight, tactical pen, TQ (Everyday Carry Tourniquet), phone, wallet, and keys. My thick leather belt is more than adequate for carrying all that, and with most of that tucked into my pockets, the only things visible are the clips on the knife and flashlight (and sometimes the EDC pen).

If you're in a somewhat hostile environment, but still trying to keep the "grey man" appearance, but want to stay prepared with a bit more gear, then I would argue that an ultra-low-profile chest rig would be less noticeable to the untrained eye than a more "tactical" belt. Of course, your chest rig would have to be in a minimalist configuration, and you'd need a way to cover it while still retaining access (i.e. under a loose-fitting flannel over-shirt or a light jacket, preferably with a pattern so as to break up the print lines). Even the lowest profile operator belts are super obvious once you begin hanging gear off of them, so I'm not convinced they fit into a "grey man" kit.

If you're in a full-fledged combat zone, and you expect it to stay that way for a while, then ditch the EDC setup and go with a full-on battle belt with spare rifle & pistol mags, IFAK, radio, multi-tool, dump pouch, and Skittles. This is the only scenario in which a belt like this is appropriate, IMO (except training, of course). It's cool to have high-speed gear, but it's heavy/bulky, and in an actual prolonged gunfight, it's hard to put a price on mobility. That being said, if the Chinese are invading, I can't think of a better time to put on a battle belt.

For 99.999999% of your "missions", an American-made belt of thick dead cow is tough to beat. Plus it has that classic look. :thumbsup2:


Tue Feb 13, 2024 9:24 pm
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At 2:18 in this video you'll see them remove half of the cobra buckle so that a pouch can fit over the belt. Any belt-loop holster will also require removing half of the cobra buckle to do this. 1.5", 2" belt... doesn't matter. You don't have to do that on a leather belt. You'll also see them go through iterations of placement to get the rigger's belt adjusted for fit. Again, no need to go through that with a leather belt as one end has no buckle and a leather belt utilizes holes for interacting with the buckle for sizing. This guy even uses needle nose pliers to get what he feels is proper tension on a belt using a cobra buckle.

[youtube1]https://gbrsgroupgear.com/collections/gear/products/gbrs-group-assaulter-belt-system-v2[/youtube1]

This isn't a criticism of the cobra buckle system, but merely commentary that these are steps required to use one, and the steps are more involved than a traditional belt.

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“Finding ‘common ground’ with the thinking of evil men is a fool’s errand” ~ Herschel Smith

"The said Constitution shall never be construed to authorize Congress to prevent the people of the United States who are peaceable citizens from keeping their own arms." ~ Samuel Adams

“A return to First Principles in a Republic is sometimes caused by simple virtues of a single man. His good example has such an influence that the good men strive to imitate him, and the wicked are ashamed to lead a life so contrary to his example. Before all else, be armed!” ~ Niccolo Machiavelli

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Tue Feb 13, 2024 9:39 pm
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I run a low-pro inner belt from Blue Alpha Gear for my every day belt. It's got the fuzz side of the velcro all the way around and it's pretty non-tacticool to the untrained eye. I appendix carry a 19 sized gun most days, it works very well for that application AND doesn't have a big dumb belt buckle so I don't have to swap it out when I get to work (mechanic, don't want a metal buckle scratching cars). The velcro inner/cobra buckle + velcro outer setup is kinda standard fair at this point and it's definitely the way to go for the needs of most larperators.

I have a Cobra buckle belt for the days I feel like using an OWB setup, not a fan over a standard leather gun belt. Regular ol' leather belt is a lot faster to thread through holsters and belt loops. I actually modifed the only holster I use with it so that I can stuff the buckle end of the cobra setup through the loops instead of having to remove it to thread through the holster. It has the small style cobra buckle that fits through belt loops so that's a non-issue.


Tue Feb 13, 2024 9:40 pm
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For a two pc system, I like that Blue Alpha Gear inner belt. It looks like you can really reef down tight on it before starting to tamp down the velcro.

After some thought though,and in agreement with GFL: My Hank's belt is sufficient for day to day. I think a thin-line padded belt like the HSGI, or the Blue Alpha Gear micro belt with their padded overlay - allowing use over and independent of existing casual clothing - would be ideal.

I like the almost slick PC under a smock or baggy jacket, and with the right smock ( https://store.arktis.co.uk/collections/ ... live-green ) both the PC and micro belt would be nearly invisible along with keepin the load off the plate carrier.

BTW: "Larperator" :thumbsup2:

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“Finding ‘common ground’ with the thinking of evil men is a fool’s errand” ~ Herschel Smith

"The said Constitution shall never be construed to authorize Congress to prevent the people of the United States who are peaceable citizens from keeping their own arms." ~ Samuel Adams

“A return to First Principles in a Republic is sometimes caused by simple virtues of a single man. His good example has such an influence that the good men strive to imitate him, and the wicked are ashamed to lead a life so contrary to his example. Before all else, be armed!” ~ Niccolo Machiavelli

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FJB


Tue Feb 13, 2024 9:59 pm
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Guns4Liberty wrote:
Mission dictates gear.

If you're going to the grocery store, just about any sturdy belt will do. I prefer thick leather, but the ratcheting nylon belts are nice because you can make micro-adjustments on the fly. Either way, it just needs to be enough to hold your pants up, including all your EDC gear. For me, EDC gear is pistol (leather IWB), spare mag (leather IWB), folding knife, flashlight, tactical pen, TQ (Everyday Carry Tourniquet), phone, wallet, and keys. My thick leather belt is more than adequate for carrying all that, and with most of that tucked into my pockets, the only things visible are the clips on the knife and flashlight (and sometimes the EDC pen).
For 99.999999% of your "missions", an American-made belt of thick dead cow is tough to beat. Plus it has that classic look. :thumbsup2:


You just made my point. :bigsmile:

All that other gear doesn't need to be hanging off a belt for EDC so why would you need anything more than a dead Cow belt for EDC? I just don't get the whole "Battle belt" or whatever for the issue at hand, just keep it simple and not blend in.

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Tue Feb 13, 2024 10:13 pm
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jukk0u wrote:
At 2:18 in this video you'll see them remove half of the cobra buckle so that a pouch can fit over the belt. Any belt-loop holster will also require removing half of the cobra buckle to do this. 1.5", 2" belt... doesn't matter. You don't have to do that on a leather belt. You'll also see them go through iterations of placement to get the rigger's belt adjusted for fit. Again, no need to go through that with a leather belt as one end has no buckle and a leather belt utilizes holes for interacting with the buckle for sizing. This guy even uses needle nose pliers to get what he feels is proper tension on a belt using a cobra buckle.

[youtube1]https://gbrsgroupgear.com/collections/gear/products/gbrs-group-assaulter-belt-system-v2[/youtube1]

This isn't a criticism of the cobra buckle system, but merely commentary that these are steps required to use one, and the steps are more involved than a traditional belt.


I get what you're saying, but you still have to remove the end of the belt from the buckle on a leather belt. It's no different than removing the end of a nylon belt from a Cobra buckle. In both, you're pulling the free end through the buckle, then putting it back. You don't have to unclip the Cobra to remove the free end. Just remove it like you would your leather or nylon belt with a normal buckle.

Note, I'm not talking about a battle belt, but a simple nylon belt that just happens to have a Cobra buckle.


Tue Feb 13, 2024 10:24 pm
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