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It is currently Fri Mar 29, 2024 4:24 am
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[ 13 posts ] |
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Reversable motor doesn't reverse
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RocketScott
Site Supporter
Location: Kentucky Joined: Fri Jan 16, 2015 Posts: 11049
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Yesterday my driver's side window wouldn't go back up after lowering it. Got a new set of gears from Oh Really and Bob's your uncle. Good news is that while I was in there I fixed the power door lock, just needed to solder the wires back together at the door hinge. Also replaced all the widow seals and track. I had bought them a while ago but never got around to replacing them
So today the passenger side decided to act up. The motor will go up, but not down. Tore it all apart and tested the power +12v to go one way, -12v to go the other. Checked continuity on the motor, resistance is normal and flows both directions. Took the motor apart and cleaned out the carbon. Brushes look old but good enough. Still no worky in both directions
So with only two wires going to the motor what would allow it to turn one way but not the other?
_________________ You may be right, I may be crazy, but it just may be a lunatic you're looking for
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Tue Aug 25, 2020 3:06 pm |
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Arisaka
Site Supporter
Location: Tacoma Joined: Sat May 4, 2013 Posts: 6196
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RocketScott wrote: Yesterday my driver's side window wouldn't go back up after lowering it. Got a new set of gears from Oh Really and Bob's your uncle. Good news is that while I was in there I fixed the power door lock, just needed to solder the wires back together at the door hinge. Also replaced all the widow seals and track. I had bought them a while ago but never got around to replacing them
So today the passenger side decided to act up. The motor will go up, but not down. Tore it all apart and tested the power +12v to go one way, -12v to go the other. Checked continuity on the motor, resistance is normal and flows both directions. Took the motor apart and cleaned out the carbon. Brushes look old but good enough. Still no worky in both directions
So with only two wires going to the motor what would allow it to turn one way but not the other? Bad switch?
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Tue Aug 25, 2020 3:41 pm |
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RocketScott
Site Supporter
Location: Kentucky Joined: Fri Jan 16, 2015 Posts: 11049
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Arisaka wrote: Bad switch? No, I push the up button and it reads +12v at the connector, push down and it goes to -12v
_________________ You may be right, I may be crazy, but it just may be a lunatic you're looking for
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Tue Aug 25, 2020 3:45 pm |
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Arisaka
Site Supporter
Location: Tacoma Joined: Sat May 4, 2013 Posts: 6196
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RocketScott wrote: Arisaka wrote: Bad switch? No, I push the up button and it reads +12v at the connector, push down and it goes to -12v Did you jumpier from the battery to the window motor, and then reverse the connections? Did motor work in both directions, or only one direction?
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Tue Aug 25, 2020 4:47 pm |
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Selador
Site Supporter
Location: Index Joined: Thu Aug 23, 2012 Posts: 12963
Real Name: Jeff
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Arisaka wrote: RocketScott wrote: Arisaka wrote: Bad switch? No, I push the up button and it reads +12v at the connector, push down and it goes to -12v Did you jumpier from the battery to the window motor, and then reverse the connections? Did motor work in both directions, or only one direction? This. There is a connector in the two lines that go to the motor. Disconnect that. Then run jumper wires all the way from that connector, to the battery. Hold those to the battery one way. Then the other. Does the motor operate in both polarities, or just the one? If the motor operates correctly, it is the switch, regardless of the previous test. (Or somewhere in the wiring.) It it doesn't operate in both polarities, then it's the motor. In which case, I would look again at those brushes.
_________________ -Jeff
How can I help you, and/or make you smile, today?
You are entitled to your opinion. You are not entitled to tell me what mine must be.
Do justice. Love mercy.
“I would rather have questions that can't be answered than answers that can't be questioned.” ~ Richard P. Feynman
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Tue Aug 25, 2020 5:12 pm |
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RocketScott
Site Supporter
Location: Kentucky Joined: Fri Jan 16, 2015 Posts: 11049
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Arisaka wrote: RocketScott wrote: Arisaka wrote: Bad switch? No, I push the up button and it reads +12v at the connector, push down and it goes to -12v Did you jumpier from the battery to the window motor, and then reverse the connections? Did motor work in both directions, or only one direction? I didn't jumper to the motor since the connector had +12/-12 consistently Being the age that it is I did the highly technical procedure of tapping on things and moving the wires in different directions, pushing/pulling, while hooked up to the multimeter. No difference in voltage or continuity within the motor I just don't understand how the coil (the whole system really) could work one way but not the other. I took the whole thing apart to clean it. No broken wires, checked continuity between all the pairs of commutators... There's a circuit breaker within the motor, I cleaned the contacts but if that were failing the motor shouldn't work either way It works by reversing voltage through the same set of coils, which is rotating between a pair of magnets. Stupid simple I already ordered new motors and regulators for both sides from rock auto. At 33 years old it's time to replace all of it. This just bugs me that I can't understand how it's failing in one direction and not the other. The brushes look like 30 year old brushes would look. I'll see if I can get the same size from McLendon next time I'm there. I would think that if the brushes are going to wear out over time then the UP bushing would wear out first. The DOWN bushing would be the ground in that scenario. Both get worked but the ground bushing gets less voltage since the coil has a resistance and some voltage is lost to heat
_________________ You may be right, I may be crazy, but it just may be a lunatic you're looking for
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Tue Aug 25, 2020 5:46 pm |
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RocketScott
Site Supporter
Location: Kentucky Joined: Fri Jan 16, 2015 Posts: 11049
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Selador wrote: Arisaka wrote: RocketScott wrote: Arisaka wrote: Bad switch? No, I push the up button and it reads +12v at the connector, push down and it goes to -12v Did you jumpier from the battery to the window motor, and then reverse the connections? Did motor work in both directions, or only one direction? This. There is a connector in the two lines that go to the motor. Disconnect that. Then run jumper wires all the way from that connector, to the battery. Hold those to the battery one way. Then the other. Does the motor operate in both polarities, or just the one? If the motor operates correctly, it is the switch, regardless of the previous test. (Or somewhere in the wiring.) It it doesn't operate in both polarities, then it's the motor. In which case, I would look again at those brushes. Is is possible that the switch is 'working' but not letting enough amps through to work the motor?
_________________ You may be right, I may be crazy, but it just may be a lunatic you're looking for
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Tue Aug 25, 2020 5:49 pm |
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Arisaka
Site Supporter
Location: Tacoma Joined: Sat May 4, 2013 Posts: 6196
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It’s possible the wiring, relay or ground are bad. If you jump to the motor and it works, the problem is between the motor and the switch
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Tue Aug 25, 2020 6:07 pm |
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RocketScott
Site Supporter
Location: Kentucky Joined: Fri Jan 16, 2015 Posts: 11049
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Sunofabitch
I put it all back together to drive home. The window now works. Up and down
Sometimes I honestly believe that bitch just wants me to give her attention and buy her things
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
_________________ You may be right, I may be crazy, but it just may be a lunatic you're looking for
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Tue Aug 25, 2020 6:44 pm |
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Selador
Site Supporter
Location: Index Joined: Thu Aug 23, 2012 Posts: 12963
Real Name: Jeff
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RocketScott wrote: Selador wrote: Arisaka wrote: RocketScott wrote: Arisaka wrote: Bad switch? No, I push the up button and it reads +12v at the connector, push down and it goes to -12v Did you jumpier from the battery to the window motor, and then reverse the connections? Did motor work in both directions, or only one direction? This. There is a connector in the two lines that go to the motor. Disconnect that. Then run jumper wires all the way from that connector, to the battery. Hold those to the battery one way. Then the other. Does the motor operate in both polarities, or just the one? If the motor operates correctly, it is the switch, regardless of the previous test. (Or somewhere in the wiring.) It it doesn't operate in both polarities, then it's the motor. In which case, I would look again at those brushes. Is is possible that the switch is 'working' but not letting enough amps through to work the motor? Exactly what I was going to explain after your response to Arisaka. But you figured it out for yourself. If it's working now, then it's possible you have a nicked wire. That can happen, and you can't actually see where it is. But what can happen is that some of the strands in the wire get broken. Then not enough amperage can get through what is left of the full wire. Then you'll move things around, and the broken strands will contact each other for a while again. And it will work. Then, you'll have the same problem all over again. I have also seen the same problem right at connectors, or even in the connection between the two pieces of the connectors itself. As well as inside a switch. (I have had MANY window and lock switches completely apart and fixed them. I can be kind of stingy sometimes...)
_________________ -Jeff
How can I help you, and/or make you smile, today?
You are entitled to your opinion. You are not entitled to tell me what mine must be.
Do justice. Love mercy.
“I would rather have questions that can't be answered than answers that can't be questioned.” ~ Richard P. Feynman
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Tue Aug 25, 2020 6:56 pm |
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NWGunner
Site Supporter
Location: South Seattle Joined: Thu May 2, 2013 Posts: 12419
Real Name: Steve
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RocketScott wrote: Sunofabitch
I put it all back together to drive home. The window now works. Up and down
Sometimes I honestly believe that bitch just wants me to give her attention and buy her things
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Tue Aug 25, 2020 7:36 pm |
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Arisaka
Site Supporter
Location: Tacoma Joined: Sat May 4, 2013 Posts: 6196
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RocketScott wrote: Sunofabitch
I put it all back together to drive home. The window now works. Up and down
Sometimes I honestly believe that bitch just wants me to give her attention and buy her things
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk My shit never fixes itself.
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Tue Aug 25, 2020 8:22 pm |
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Sinus211
Site Moderator
Location: Marysville Joined: Thu Mar 22, 2012 Posts: 13483
Real Name: Mike
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Arisaka wrote: RocketScott wrote: Sunofabitch
I put it all back together to drive home. The window now works. Up and down
Sometimes I honestly believe that bitch just wants me to give her attention and buy her things
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk My shit never fixes itself. That’s because all your projects lived through the the Great Depression and have that “Fix it yourself, asshole!” mentality.
_________________Licensed/Bonded/Insured Hardwood Floor Installer/Finisher http://www.hardwoodfloorsnw.com/
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Tue Aug 25, 2020 9:40 pm |
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