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Discussion or advice on how to create an Illegal NFA item will result in an immediate ban. No advice given within should replace user due diligence. Always consult a lawyer / professional.



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 Question about HPA 
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So let's say you go to your local gun store and buy a silencer,you send in all the required paperwork and then somehow a miracle happens and the HPA passes. Can the local gun store you bought it from then call you and have you come in and fill out the 4474 and let you take your new suppressor home,or since its in the system you have to wait for it to go through. Anyone know? I'm thinking if it does somehow pass there's going to be a run on silencers so it might take as long as it used too.


Sun Jul 16, 2017 12:10 pm
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As it is currently written, you would get your $200 tax refunded (as atf makes sure they take your money in the first 30 days but drags out putting a stamp on your form for 6-10 months) and you could run down and 4473 it the day the law goes into effect. There are a few things to keep in mind about the HPA- it is not guaranteed and has not even made it to the floor yet for a review to see if it even has a chance at passing this year, anything in it can be rewritten or removed before it makes it to the floor, it can get tweaked as it goes through the house and senate, everyone says it going to happen tomorrow but its already been two years since it was first introduced and it is currently at the bottom of every politicians list of things they need to get done. As a reminder to how out there the HPA is, the house and senate still can't even get its s&*t together on how to repeal the ACA/Obamacare (whether you actually want to see it repealed or expanded or replaced with a single payer/ two tier system/ socialized healthcare or it be a completely free market isn't the conversation im trying to start) when the house, senate and president are all on the same side and all ran on the promise of a fast and aggressive repeal.

The other thing to think about is what silencers will look like if they are no longer NFA items. If you look at countries that don't strictly regulate silencers (either treat them and paper them like regular firearms or don't have any registration/regulations/paperwork), you will find they are nothing like the silencers we have. They are cheap, disposable, mostly aluminum and not made to last a lifetime. The days of Inconel, stellite and titanium being the standard materials used and them being built as a single lifetime purchase will go away. Also, as things currently are, we don't pay an excise tax on silencers (FAET excise tax rate is 10% for pistols and revolvers and 11% for all other firearms) but we will if the HPA passes (you get your $200 tax back but a $1,000 silencer commands $110 in excise tax back to the feds once the HPA passes).

If you want a silencer, just go do the paperwork and pay the tax. The silencers that are available today have a lifespan measured in hundreds of thousands of rounds and almost everyone comes with a lifetime warranty. If the HPA passes, you get $200 back for each one you have and if it doesn't, you have a silencer that will last until the day you die. I hope there will be a day when silencers are just something we can run down to the local gun shop and take home the same day and its viewed as unsportsmanlike and obnoxious to shoot or hunt without one (like the rest of the world), but until then, I will continue to pay the taxman when I want to add another one to the collection.

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Thu Jul 20, 2017 11:14 am
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The mad scientist wrote:
The other thing to think about is what silencers will look like if they are no longer NFA items. If you look at countries that don't strictly regulate silencers (either treat them and paper them like regular firearms or don't have any registration/regulations/paperwork), you will find they are nothing like the silencers we have. They are cheap, disposable, mostly aluminum and not made to last a lifetime. The days of Inconel, stellite and titanium being the standard materials used and them being built as a single lifetime purchase will go away. Also, as things currently are, we don't pay an excise tax on silencers (FAET excise tax rate is 10% for pistols and revolvers and 11% for all other firearms) but we will if the HPA passes (you get your $200 tax back but a $1,000 silencer commands $110 in excise tax back to the feds once the HPA passes).



While I agree there will be a bunch of new suppressors out that are cheap if/when it passes, I don't think that means that you wont be able to get a good quality suppressor made with titanium and whatever other fancy metals are out there. If there is a market, someone will built and sell them.

I can go buy a PSA AR10 for $699, but I own a $3000 SCAR17. I like quality, and I am willing to bet that I am not the only one.


Thu Jul 20, 2017 11:29 am
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Cheap silencers already exist. You can get one for $99.

https://rebelsilencers.com


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Thu Jul 20, 2017 11:31 am
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There will always be a market for high end products, Ferrari and Lamborghini build some incredible cars but that isn't what the average car looks like. The current market for silencers is almost entirely made up of products that are built to last a lifetime but without the commitment that comes with the NFA, silencers will begin looking like the rest of the world. I have been to the other side of the world and have seen their silencers, and quite frankly they are no where near comparable to what is available here. There will always be high end silencers, just like high end firearms but just like high end firearms, there will be 50 PSA budget rifles to each SCAR and the price difference between a lifetime purchase (your $3000 SCAR and my MEGA SBR) and simply a rifle to go shoot will be similar as well. As it is today, you can buy a QD SRD556 that is made entirely out of Inconel for $579.99 but am willing to bet it will be two to three times that if the HPA passes, as supply and demand will take hold and push prices up for silencers that will last a lifetime, when you no longer have to wait 10 months to be able to pick it up.

You can get a 22lr silencer for $40nzd ($29.64 US), so there is still quite a ways to go before you get to the really cheap silencers. I know gemtech, rebel, PSD and Radical firearms make some cheap silencers but that was not the level of cheap I was referring to. In the countries that don't regulate silencers it's not uncommon to be able to buy a 22 silencer for $30-50 and a rifle silencer for $100-200, which is where I was going with that statement. But the rebel, PSD, radical, ect. silencers you can buy now are still built to last a lifetime, which is a perfect example why you should just go but one now if you want a silencer, instead of hoping and waiting for the HPA to pass.

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Life isn't about the money you make, the car you drive, the house you live in or being the CEO of a company. Life is about enjoying each day, experiencing everything the world has to offer you and when the day comes, standing at your makers door fully satisfied with what you did with the little bit of sand that was put in your hourglass.


Thu Jul 20, 2017 12:12 pm
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